Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to vicarious insights, the podcast where we dive into the world of disabilities, learning from experts, providers, participants, and their families. I'm your host, Jace, and today we have part two of our special guest, Lillian, from the parent support network. And Lillian's here to share a personal story and discuss the nurtured heart approach, which is a methodology that has had a significant impact on families. So, Lillian, welcome back.
[00:00:24] Speaker B: Awesome to be back, Jase. It seems like yesterday we were chatting.
[00:00:29] Speaker A: It was for me because I was still editing, editing last night. So we were both talking, from my perspective, a little bit of a recap, just in case anybody is tuning in, and this is their first one. We talked a bit of your personal experience. We were talking about the three stands. So there was absolutely no. Absolutely yes. And absolutely clear.
[00:00:51] Speaker B: Well done. You remembered. That's awesome. You have the greatness of having a great memory and paying attention. Absolutely yes. Just a real quick recap. So, I'm a mom of two, two adult sons. My youngest son was diagnosed with ADHD, odD and childhood depression as a little boy. He's now 31. We have had quite an extraordinary journey with him, both a blessed journey and a challenging journey at the same time. Along the way, came to realize that there was a lot more to assisting our family to have happy and healthy relationships than what we initially started with, which was the physiology, the body, the food, the diet. Over time, we found a parenting coach who really, really, really helped us to get out of a very dark place with our son and with our family. And then we were very, very fortunate to find the nurtured heart approach. Even though I've been doing parenting work for 25 plus years, I pretty much exclusively used the nurtured heart approach, which I first found out about in 2013. I became an accredited trainer for in 2014 and an advanced trainer in 2021. It's a beautiful approach. And the premise of the nurtured heart approach is to build inner wealth. And what I mean by inner wealth is the sense of, first of all, for ourselves as parents and adults, our sense of self, our self esteem, self worth, self love, connection, our sense of who are we as a person for us adults to be in the place where we can help build that inner wealth for our children. We want to build a portfolio of greatness through the nurtured heart approach, so that as our children grow up, they have a real sense of who they are. I am a strong person. I am resilient. I am respectful, I am kind. I do have great self control. I do make great choices, and we teach all of this through a three stand process, as you said before. Absolutely no. Absolutely yes and absolutely clear. Many parents, unknowingly, and educators and carers, people who work with children are parenting or communicating in an upside down way. So we're giving so much more attention, connection and relationship to things going wrong. All the things that we don't want to grow, like disrespect, not listening, being uncooperative, fighting or squabbling. We tend to give more energy and relationship and connection when all the things are going wrong. Stan one, absolutely no is all about not giving more of us when things are going wrong. Not giving attention and connection and relationship to the things we don't want to grow, the disrespect, not cooperating. They're not getting things done, they're not listening. And that's when we usually come to life as parents. It's quite a mind shift for us to go out of that space of giving more of us when things are going wrong to then stepping into stand two, which is absolutely yes. Looking for all of the opportunities to embrace the greatness and the qualities that we're seeing in our children. Even the baby step. 30 seconds ago, a minute ago, that kid could have been disrespectful, not listening, being rude. Whatever they were doing, that was inappropriate. But now they're taking steps towards doing something more appropriate. This is where we come in and give our energy not to what we don't want to grow, but to what we do want to grow. I now see you're looking at me. You're no longer yelling. That's showing me that you're really respectful. I know you're upset, but you're using amazing self control at the moment. You're not yelling, you're not swearing. You're ready to listen. I know you're upset. It shows me so much about who you are as a person. And build that up. In Stan two, we have a series of recognition techniques that we teach. We teach people how to switch the way they're currently communicating to a way that is in a more heart centered way and really focusing on the positive. Stan three is absolute clarity. Because just like in a sporting game or a video game or any sort of thing, you've got to have clarity. You've got to have rules. When you're playing tennis or basketball, if the ball goes out, it's out, right? In a video game, if you muck up, you get kicked out of the game. You know there are clear rules. And kids who play sport or play video games know what the clear rules are, and they know the consequences. Whatever is going to happen when you muck up the rule, we need those clear rules in our parenting as well. But the difference is we teach something called the reset. So instead of giving a consequence as a punishment, go to your room, timeout, taking away privileges and that sort of thing, which traditionally don't work, we just teach something called a reset, which helps the children to self control, to look at their own nervous system, to calm themselves down. Just like in a video game, when you get kicked out of the game, you know you can reset and get back in the game again. We teach the children that all they need to do is this simple reset so they can get back into the game again, back into life, back into whatever's happening. Of course, if there's a serious thing that's happened, there's going to be a consequence, but we're not going to deal with that in this moment. We want wanting to look for in stand three, we're wanting to look for the quickest opportunity to get back into stand two and to give an acknowledgement of steps moving forward. So that's the three stands again in a nutshell. And maybe I gave it a little bit of a different perspective than last time for people who have listened to the last one as well.
[00:06:06] Speaker A: With me, I work with a lot of guys with neurodiverse personalities with the reset is something like just having some sensory toys there for them to go, all right, this is going to help me to recalibrate whatever it takes.
[00:06:19] Speaker B: I find the best way to teach the reset is to model it. We normally model the reset as just taking the time to take a deep breath, close your eyes, do some deep breathing. Turn away from the situation. The kids might be upset with the parents, so they need to turn away from the parents and just reset themselves. Take those deep breaths. They might need to walk out of the room. They might have a sensory toy of some sort, like my son used to have a punching bag that he would use to calm himself down. Whatever it takes, we can model different ways of doing it. Sometimes, if it's a really major thing, a simple breathing might not be enough. You might need to actually remove yourself from the situation, or you as the parent might even have to remove one child away from another child if there's an escalation still. So it does depend on the circumstance. But usually kids learn to self regulate really well. And when they know they're not going to be punished in a. In a punitive sort of way, they love the reset. Because it just allows them to work on their own nervous system and to self regulate. Kids will actually start resetting without even being prompted. I'm not a fan of saying to the kids, you must reset, because once again, we can't make anybody do anything, but let's just say everybody's escalated and upset. You might say in front of the kids, hey, look, I need to calm myself down. I'm going to reset myself, take a few deep breaths, and then I invite you to join me or to do the same. They may or may, they may not. We can't make them, but as soon as they have, we want to celebrate them for doing their reset and for coming back in a positive way. There's one family, when you talk about neurodiverse that I was coaching with and that did my course a couple of years ago, who had two littleies who had been diagnosed with low functioning autism and both nonverbal, the little girl had more ability than the little boy. They taught the reset through a hand motion. When the parent needed to reset, they would do a hand movement. They taught the child, when the child was escalated, to do this hand movement. And the beautiful thing was the little girl who had some language. When mum and dad got cranky or needed a reset, she would tell them that they needed a reset.
[00:08:25] Speaker A: The other one that was more nonverbal. They were able to take this on just from the modeling.
[00:08:30] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. And, I mean, the little girl who was more verbal, grasped it more than the little boy did. The biggest change for this family, and I'm thinking particularly of the dad, who was a big, gruff, kind of almost biky looking dad with the big beard, beautiful man. But he's the one who said, oh, this is some stupid tree hugging thing.
Yeah, yeah, that. Because I think the kids pick up when the energy of the parents change. So even if they're nonverbal, if dad or mum are not angry or grumpy, they sense that they pick up on the energy. So when we can calm ourselves down, so if we're feeling escalated because of something the kids are doing or saying, if we calm ourselves down, then the kids who are not as verbal or who may not be able to communicate the same as other kids, can pick up on that energy. So just by us calming ourselves down, they're then like, okay, mum was angry, but now she's calming herself down, so it's okay. They're not feeling so worried about what's happening or about mum or dad being upset or yelling. No kid like yelling or screaming. But the more sensitive. Kids are sensitive, and they really take that to heart. When mum or dad get angry and use loud voices. We have to be really mindful of our energy in and around our children, even if not directly. Like I always say to parents, Jace, if you have a challenge as two adults and you've got words that you want to say, please don't ever say them around children, because they will pick up on that energy. Even if they don't understand the context of the conversation, they will pick up on that energy, and then they'll feel bad. Mum and dad aren't getting on. Maybe it's my fault. Maybe it's because of something I did. They take a lot of that on. So, parents, we have to be really mindful. If you've got to have an angry conversation, go and lock yourself in the car. Go and lock yourself out in the backyard somewhere where the kids won't hear you. Or wait until, you know, the kids are totally out of earshot because the energy can be picked up in the next room. It can be, kids are so good at picking up energy.
[00:10:28] Speaker A: So for myself, and hopefully for anyone listening, I do a lot of group stuff. We gonna have different personalities, I'm gonna say similar disabilities. Most of the guys that do train with me, I feel they've been lucky enough to have some psych support ot those sorts of things that they're going through, and then they're really helping, I believe they seem to know, or maybe they're masking. Are you sitting down the grass because you're being lazy, or do you need to sit down on the grass? And they're like, yeah, I need to do this.
[00:10:55] Speaker B: That is a reset. That's what they're doing. Probably they're resetting themselves because they're feeling escalated and they're just taking that time out. So we do need to allow them to take that time out. And that's why sometimes it's challenging in classrooms, because it's so structured, and you must sit down and you must, you know, face the board and you must listen. You know, sometimes kids need to get up and move around, or they need to just take some space, or, you know, like, we need to allow them that space.
[00:11:20] Speaker A: If we're looking at the. Absolutely no. If there is something that is maybe a little bit more than them getting the reset and I'm needing to lead them to water reset rather than allowing that escalation, I do like to let things go how they need to go. What would your advice be in that moment of a potential escalation mid escalation.
[00:11:41] Speaker B: There's two ways you can approach it. So firstly, and you've got to be fast, right? Because you don't have time, time for things to escalate. I can see that you're feeling upset, but I want to acknowledge you for feeling your feelings. You're letting us know how you're feeling. I mean, even if they're having a tantrum, they're expressing themselves, so you can actually acknowledge them for expressing themselves. Or if you can sense that things are going to get more escalated, but they have it. I can see you're feeling a bit. Whatever word you want to use, escalated, you know, upset, angry. But here you are, and you're kind of hijacking them a little bit. Here you are using such great self control. Look at you in this moment. You could be stomping around, throwing things, hurting somebody, but you're not. You're upset, but you're really handling your feelings really well. So you want to jump on that as quick as you can before it escalates, because if you can grab it before it escalates too much. And I know that's difficult sometimes when you're in a group. If you can get it as early as you can and acknowledge them for something, acknowledge them for, like, even if they're really having a full on hissy fit. But they could be. You could be punching me, but you're not. And you know what? You're angry. You're upset. You could be punching me, you could be hurting me, but you're using amazing self control in this moment. So even though they could be swearing at you or whatever they're doing, they could be doing something worse. And by highlighting. And it's not giving them the idea, because some people then say, isn't that giving them the idea? You were thinking that, right?
Because we're wanting to tell them that we see their self control, we see their compassion. You could have. When Joe kicked you, you could have kicked him back, but you didn't. You know, what that shows me about you is you're such a kind and compassionate person. And the other thing is, say, for example, there's an escalation, and the offender hurts or offends another person. You can acknowledge the person who's not the offender, but the person who's been violated or spoken to rudely or hurt about how they're handling the situation. That must have been really tough when Jimmy called you that name or when he shoved you. But look at how you're handling yourself. You are handling your feelings. So, well, you could have got really angry at him and you didn't. Wow, mate, that is amazing self control you have. Now, of course, you've got to say it in your own blokey way. The flowery stuff doesn't sit well with the guys, you know, especially once they're sort of teenagers and beyond. But like, mate, that is flipping amazing self control. You could have really got angry then when he did that and you didn't. Oh, my gosh, how did you even do that? How did you manage to train yourself? And then he's going to be like, you know, really proud of himself because in actual fact, he could have lashed out, he could have punched the person, he could have done something, but they chose not to. So acknowledging that person and then that's also going to be an example to the rest of the group. So if you were saying that in a group situation, you're not only helping to build that person's inner wealth, but you're showing the rest of the group what it means to have great self control, to be compassionate, thoughtful, a good friend. So when you're giving these acknowledgments to a group, you're giving that example to the whole group, even though you're focusing on one person. But just make sure your language is relevant to bloke, to bloke, like, it's different than a mum speaking to a little five year old girl, for example. So you're going to use a different sort of language. But, you know, hey, mate, I. Gosh, I'm proud of you for that. You really could have, but you didn't. Oh, gosh, how do you have such great self control? Like, even say it in that way? I don't know how you did it. How could they not but feel good then? No matter how upset they're feeling in that moment or angry with the other person who might have said something nasty or done something to them, they're got to be feeling good because you, their favorite toy, their adult of influence, is acknowledging them for handling that situation so well. And that's going to be an example to the whole group. Really powerful. I help the clients that I work with increase their vocabulary of recognition because sometimes we have something called an active recognition. It's just acknowledging what they do. Hey, mate, I just noticed you. You picked up the footballs and put them away. Thanks heaps. You know, like just acknowledging them for things.
[00:16:03] Speaker A: Oh, that one's great. We've done that recently. Now they're putting the boxing stuff away and I'm like, thank you. You guys are amazing. Thank you so much.
[00:16:11] Speaker B: Acknowledge them. That shows me, you know, you're such a great part of the team, and I really appreciate and respect you because, gosh, I forget the balls half the time. But here you are. You've remembered. You put them back in the box. That's amazing. And then the other kid who didn't pick them up this time, heard your recognition. They're like, I want a piece of that action. So next time I'm going to beat him to pick up the balls and I'm going to pick them up and put them back in the bag or the bot or whatever.
[00:16:34] Speaker A: The guys I've got, I think a lot of them are tuned that way. So it's like you said, you've got the two types. You've got the ones that are going for the relationship and the ones that are going for the approval. They get it. They're like, I like you saying nice things to him. I'm going to do that, too. And I see them and, and, and I use it to my advantage or for their advantage, just to my advantage, actually stepping into that. So this is where I'm going to brag. Yeah. I'm sort of excited. They're not completely finished yet, but you were talking about some little love heart things and you said you're probably not going to do little love heart things, Jason. You're right. So I've got the certificates that the boys are going to get now. I'm only going to give one out each session, but we've got perseverance.
[00:17:14] Speaker B: You're amazing. We've got to share those with me. Yeah.
[00:17:18] Speaker A: Respect caring for others.
[00:17:22] Speaker B: If you make those up.
[00:17:23] Speaker A: Yes. Now, you just said good friend. And just when you said that before, I'm thinking I might change caring for others to being a good friend, or I might add good friend into it.
[00:17:31] Speaker B: Caring for others is good. I like that.
[00:17:34] Speaker A: But what I've got in there is name, how you earned this and what it says about you.
[00:17:40] Speaker B: That's beautiful.
[00:17:42] Speaker A: So. And that's directly from what you were talking about last week. I loved it. Like, I didn't. I don't know how much of my stuff I. My speaking I actually cut out was probably a fair bit, but I got quite excited. When you're talking about that.
[00:17:53] Speaker B: Awesome.
[00:17:54] Speaker A: What I do with these guys is in a bubble. What happens outside of when they're with me, I can see their growth. You know, the parents don't tell me they see the growth, but I can see their growth. I can see the interactions with others, and they're proud of stuff. Our group, what exists out of our group, but this, they can go home and be like, mum, look what I got.
[00:18:10] Speaker B: Absolutely. And the best thing you can do is brag to the parents in front of the kid.
[00:18:15] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:16] Speaker B: If you get to see the parents.
[00:18:17] Speaker A: It'S that same thing that you were saying. We get a pat on the back for a good thing and we get yelled at for a bad thing. And that's. That's the bigger repercussion.
[00:18:25] Speaker B: They look amazing. I love them.
[00:18:27] Speaker A: Thank you.
[00:18:28] Speaker B: So what greatness does that show about you? You tell me.
[00:18:31] Speaker A: I think it definitely means that I'm in the improver category.
Look what I did, Miss Lillian.
[00:18:38] Speaker B: I know, but, like, we have, like, that shows so much creativity, initiative, thoughtfulness. I think as adults, sometimes we're like, well, we can't pat ourselves on the back, but yes, we can. The fact that you went to that trouble to do that for the guys that you work with shows a lot about you, right? That you don't have to do that. You can just go in there and do the bare minimum and get paid. But you are actually wanting to make a difference for these young men. So that shows a heck of a lot about you. And those young people are lucky to have you, because look at what you've done. You've taken something you've learned and not only have you, you know, made little hearts, like, I've actually got tears in my eyes.
Seriously, she's lucky I didn't show you.
[00:19:19] Speaker A: One with a love heart. That would've been all I know.
[00:19:21] Speaker B: Right. But you've done it really from a place of, okay, I've learned something that I can do to make a difference for these kids, and you've taken action on it. You've spent time.
[00:19:32] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:19:32] Speaker B: That took a lot of time to do all of those. That's outside of, you know, some people's pay. Like, you've gone above and beyond because you really do want to make a difference for these kids. And they will notice that. And you are going to be the person who, in five or ten years, time and beyond says, I remember Jason, my sports coach, or whatever you're called. I remember when he gave me this certificate. And they tend to keep those things, remember to date them as well, because in twelve months, two years time, they'll be able to look back and go, okay, you know, in June 2024, I got that.
[00:20:06] Speaker A: I find these guys. I don't have a choice. I'm not saying that in a negative way. I'm like, they make me give them advice about something, and that makes me look internally, and then I'm like, holy crap, I need to take that advice.
[00:20:18] Speaker B: What age are they again? Because they're older kids, aren't they?
[00:20:20] Speaker A: Oh, I've got a. Met the youngest guy that I train is ten.
I do one on one with him to a registered provider, and they can only do the one on one stuff, the way the funding works. One of the other guys is twelve. He's the youngest in our group, and then we go up to about 25.
[00:20:39] Speaker B: So they're young men predominantly, aren't they?
[00:20:42] Speaker A: Yeah, only young men. And I seem to attract guys with autism or other intellectual disabilities.
Part of what I'm working through the other company as well, is to be able to get some more experience helping guys with other physical disabilities so I can.
But they're one of. One of the things with one of the young fellows there, he was telling me, saying, I'm like, man, look, I've got to tell. Why do you think I'm saying all of this to you? And he's like, he came up with a couple of ideas, like, oh, because it's something I should do, and it's because. It's because I shouldn't be naughty or because I should be good or something like that. And I'm like, mate, it's because you matter.
And the look that he gave me.
[00:21:25] Speaker B: Oh, my.
[00:21:26] Speaker A: Oh, my God. Yeah, I wasn't a blokey bloke in that man. And I tell you what, like it.
[00:21:31] Speaker B: That's being very masculine. That's. That's being beautiful. Like, being masculine doesn't mean we can't say beautiful things like that. Like that, to me, that is being masculine. You know, that is showing great masculine energy, because you see the difference that makes for the. These people. I. I really have a challenge with, you know, men. Like, oh, I can't, you know, I'm a bloke and he's a kid and he's a boy. Like, we can't, you know, speak in this way. Like it's a real old fashioned. We don't hug our boys once they turn a certain age. I'm like, bugger that for a joke. Like, my husband still hugs my boys and they're in their thirties, old fashioned sort of way of thinking. But no, that's amazing. And I bet you he did light up. Yeah, he did.
[00:22:12] Speaker A: It was just. It's like I had the holy grail in front of him. Like, the expression on his face. I was like, he didn't realize that. Like, he didn't know he mattered. Like, he knew he knows he mattered. He's an awesome family, like Keith, but, yeah, you know, keep going through bullying and all of that crap.
[00:22:28] Speaker B: When you tell them, you actually tell them the words. Yeah.
[00:22:32] Speaker A: And it's funny, little things like that. I noticed them afterwards. They come in and they try a little bit harder. Times that, you know, they would have given up. They're like, I'm gonna do it. So. Yeah. And that's the excitement of these stuff. We spoke last week about the nurture to heart. Da, would you be able to elaborate on some practical ways some parents can implement these? How this dance or the dance in their daily interaction?
[00:22:57] Speaker B: If somebody presented a complicated dance with steps, and I would look at that and go, there's no way I can duplicate that dance, but if somebody taught that to me, step by step. Okay, this week we're going to learn a couple of simple hand movements and practice them all week. And then next week, we're going to learn a couple of foot movements. And then the third week, we're going to incorporate these couple of hand movements with these foot movements, we're going to practice that. And then when we get that bit, we're going to do the next part of the dance. So it's a little bit similar with the nurtured heart. You have to learn the components separately, somewhat. And then once you've learned the movements, that is the stands, the three stance, then you can incorporate them into one dance. And when you are confident with this dance, you don't need to be in your head, you're more in your heart. You don't have to be going, stand one, don't give attention to the negative. Stand two, oh, I've got to be positive. Or stand three, what are the rules and consequences? Reset, like, you just are in the dance in any given moment, you might go, okay, there's an opportunity for acknowledgement, I'm in stand two. Or then it might be. There might be a challenge, okay, something's happening there. I'm in stand one. I'm not going to give that attention, connection, relationship, or I might need to go into a reset. The stands don't go in order necessarily. People want to often get to stand three. What are the rules? What are the consequences? What are the punishments? Like, how does that work? But just like, if you are building a three story house, you can't put the third story in until the foundations and the first and second story are in stand two. Is probably the most stuff to learn, all of the ways of saying, the recognitions, the different techniques. And then it takes a mindset change to go out of the traditional way of communicating, not just parenting, but just communicating in general and relationshiping, so that when you are confident, and this can take six or twelve months, I've got some of my parents who have been in my course coming back regularly for over two years because they're still learning the dance, they're still trying to refine the steps, and sometimes they know the steps and then they forget them or they muck them up and they're like, oh, shivers, I forgot that step, or I muck that step up, which we can do in a dance as well, you know. So the more we practice the steps, the more fluent they become, and then the more this way of communicating just becomes natural. It's like we now have learned another language called nurtured heart. It's like you're learning German and you can speak Germane now. You can speak nurtured heart. And are you going to be perfect at it? No. Are you going to muck it up? Yes. Are you going to fall back into that bad land of negativity? Sometimes? Yes, of course. We're humans. That happens. The more we learn it, the more good we feel about it. And the more we see the results, the beautiful blessings that come from using it, the more we're going to have in our heart. We really. I really need to work on this. I want to really communicate this way with everybody I connect with, whether it's your romantic partner, a friend, a work colleague, the kid you work with, a stranger down the street, a shop assistant, somebody in a restaurant. Finding opportunities to acknowledge greatness in people is such a beautiful feeling. And I tell you what, it's good for the person you give it to, but you actually feel so good. You go out with a spring in your step when you see that person smile or when they go, wow, you know, I've never had, nobody's ever said that to me before. And they're going away feeling good and you're going away feeling good as well. So it's a definite win win situation. The dance takes practice. It takes practice.
[00:26:32] Speaker A: Somebody that's listening in might be able to test that out. Go into a shop, come out and go, hang on. They've given me good service. Going back in and saying, hey, can I speak to the manager? Manager comes up and you're like, hey, little Sarah. There was amazing. That's the best service I've had in years. Thank you so much. And then you can go away and realize directly how good you feel about it. Can see the reaction of little Sarah and the manager.
[00:26:54] Speaker B: We do that all the time, like we in restaurants. Particularly not we, we are. I tip as well. I love to tip financially. Like it's just $5 or something, even when I go in and get my nails done. So the other day I went in. I go in there regularly. They know me. I thought it closed at five on a Sunday, but it was closing at four. I really wanted my nails done because I had that event that I had to go to on Monday and they were looking crappy. And I said, oh, could you really please try and fit me in? And they're like, oh, we got a close soon. But one of the girls said, I'll do it. They all wanted to get out of the door by 04:00. So she rushed, but she got them done. I normally tip them $5 in there every time. I always do. I just love to tip. But I gave her $10 and, like, just not because I had to. But I thanked her. I said, thank you so much, you know, for, for doing that. Because I know you were already in, you know, going home mode and you were ready to, to start packing up, but you knew I wanted these done under different circumstances. I could have come back the next day, but I really wanted them done. I mucked up my times, etcetera. She just had a smile on her face. And, I mean, the $10 was nice, but also the recognition was nice, too.
[00:27:58] Speaker A: How do you incorporate the nurtured heart approach into your teaching?
[00:28:03] Speaker B: That's probably exclusively what I teach now. I've been doing courses for 25 plus years. Nurtured heart for eleven years now. I used to actually do a course and it's still a great book. So this book, the best parent I can be, which is based on parenting and the law of attraction, which is kind of has some similar philosophies to nurtured heart because it's all about focusing on what you want using positive language. I actually pretty much exclusively use the nurtured heart now because it's proven to me time and time again, it works. And especially for the men, because men need something a little more systematic than women sometimes. Like my husband said, just tell me the steps. What do I need to do? I need to say not meant to do. Because the nurtured heart approach has the three clear stands, and within those stands we have certain things that we teach to be able to help you learn them. I only really do the nurtured heart. But of course, I bring in 38 years of parenting experience and 25 plus years of teaching parenting into that because I think my personal experience, of course, is huge. I am that parent with that challenging child. So when somebody comes in and they're really struggling, other people might not understand how they're really feeling, how stressful it is, how hard it is. I know it, right. I haven't met too many people who have got kids who are more challenging than our son was. When people hear our story, they're like, okay, we haven't quite got it that challenging, or I can really relate to you. So both my personal experience and, and loving the nurtured heart approach, it makes it very easy to teach because I know it works. I have enough people who use it tell me it works. It is just a beautiful way of communicating and relationshiping.
[00:29:48] Speaker A: You'd mentioned there last week that you have an open group, so once you've joined in, you've got the lifelong access, was it?
[00:29:57] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:29:58] Speaker A: So once you've signed up for it and you've gone through the teachings, you've gonna always have that support there?
[00:30:03] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.
Group I've identified that's really necessary because doing this sort of work now for decades and the nurtured heart for over ten years, I've come to realize that, you know, yes, you can pick up the book and read the book and get something from it. And yes, you can do a short course and learn some stuff, even just learning from listening to this podcast. Look at you. You've already gone and implemented stuff. But if you really want to learn it and implement it and tweak it and get it precise and really get the results, it takes ongoing participation and practice. The way my courses are designed now, I call them a rolling course. People basically have lifetime access, all of the content, a course portal that you get access to that's got 50 or 60 recordings in there. Now you go through the four ones first, which are the basic twelve sessions of information. So the learning, all the Q and A and discussion calls which we can talk about so many things that are going to be relevant to lots of families. One of the most important components is that you have the opportunity to jump on, live every fortnight, to discuss, to chat with other parents, brainstorm together, and that's where you get a lot of support. So we can do one on one sessions. With my course, you do get two one on one sessions as a part of the course. Some people like to do more one on ones. They're a little bit more private. Other people love the group sessions, but it's there for everybody.
[00:31:25] Speaker A: I was thinking there, I'm like, how did I not ask her about this? Your books. So your six books, what books have you written?
[00:31:31] Speaker B: The main one I talk about is my third book, but I've got hidden dangers, which was my first book. So that's all about the additives in food, the toxic, you know, ingredients in personal care products. It talks about a lot of statistics in here about ADHD and medications. This is my most researched book. So this actually has a lot of research in it. And then my second book, so that was written in 2003, 2005. The best me I can be. So this is a personal development book, a workbook for kids. It goes through from a to z, from like, a is for attitude, b is believing yourself, c is for challenges, d is for dream, e is for effort, f is for food, kindness, love, muscles, all sorts of things in there. So that's a workbook for children to work with independently if they're a bit older or with an adult. My third book is my favorite, which is the one you can download for free off my website, which I like for free people. Free. This is free. You can download for free from my website. The revolting child of blessing in disguise. So this is our whole journey, our whole story, from my pregnancy right through until my son was just a tad short of 16. So it talks about the big revolt when he was a teenager and our meeting our coach, but it talks about all of the early stuff as well, when he was a toddler. This is still my favourite because it's my whole story, so that's number three. Or if you want kids to cooperate, just ask. So that's 36 parenting tips. Also some tips in there from Naturopath Nathan. Still really, really relevant. Like, there's still really positive stuff, but none of these are based on the nurtured heart approach, but they're still complementary. Number five is the best parent I can be. So this is my workbook for parents. So I've got the best me I can be for kids and the best parent I can be for parents. And once again, this is in a workbook. I don't have any hard copies of either of these two left. Now, I'm not going to print any more, more because I've got hard copies of the others, but they are all available online as a digital copy. And then my last book came out of a seminar tour that I did where I had the best parent I could be. I had the best me, I can be for kids. I did a tour where I was actually teaching in a school in Horsham in Victoria, and the teacher said, oh, we would love a book for teachers. We would love a book for teachers. And I had another speaking to a book six weeks later. So in that six weeks from that tour to the next tour, I wrote this and got it printed and published and delivered directly to the next town I was going to. So I'm a fast writer.
Yeah.
[00:34:09] Speaker A: Wow. The best parent I can be, the best teacher I could be. Looking in the disability world, the support workers, there's that caring mentality is the people, whoever you're looking for. Age brackets probably don't really matter so much, but quite often people are going to be in that mentor sort of role, not a parent role, but maybe doing things along those lines. How relevant do you think those books would be for people in this space?
[00:34:34] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. But still, I'm going to promote someone else's books above my own because I still love the nurtured heart book that I use with my course that I usually have here. But I was actually showing somebody this morning, so they're behind me in the bookcase. But how to handle the intense child is the workbook that actually goes with my course. And if you join my course, you get that book anyway. But look, I love my books. I, you know, I think they're all amazing and there's a lot of great information in them and I'm an advocate for. If you've got a topic that you're interested in to read a variety of stuff. I use these more as giveaways these days. Like, I just. It's not about selling them, it's just about helping people. The nurtured heart book is definitely complements what I now teach the other one.
[00:35:20] Speaker A: There, the kids workbook. Me, I can be one. What age group would you say that.
[00:35:25] Speaker B: Would be probably most suitable to primary school age? So five to twelve. But I have had kids. 1415 love it and I have had adults love it. It's kind of a springboard for discussion. What happened was my mum passed away in May of 2005. I was so distraught. This was my healing. So I actually wrote this book just after my mum passed away. She channeled it for me somehow, but it's kind of a springboard and you don't have to read this in order. Like, if you want to talk about attitude, you go to that chapter. If you want to talk about your dreams and goals, you go to that chapter. If you want to talk about helping others. You go to h's for helping. So it's kind of a bit of a springboard for teachers or carers to have discussions with kids. A lot of schools have used these. I've sold many them to schools.
[00:36:11] Speaker A: And it's a workbook. Like they're actually printed.
[00:36:14] Speaker B: Yeah, you actually write in it. Some people don't want to write in them. If you don't want to write in them, you can just write in another book. I've got quite a few of these, so if people want to buy them, I actually sell them off, even for like $5 each or something, even though they cost me more than that to print.
[00:36:29] Speaker A: Those are really cool. Oh, we mentioned off camera, but we haven't actually mentioned on camera the parent support network. The teachings that you do are available through NDIS capacity building.
[00:36:39] Speaker B: Correct. I have many people who have joined my course through their NDIS funding.
[00:36:44] Speaker A: I can see a lot of the benefit for a lot of people, especially in our realm. The empowerment, I think is really, really important. So getting onto something specific about disability, off to decide what changes or improvements would you like to see in the way society supports and understands individuals with disabilities?
[00:37:03] Speaker B: I see everybody as an individual. I'm not a real fan of labor, and I understand they're needed for diagnosis and for getting help. But I see, you and I, every person is different. We. We respond to things differently. We have different ways of doing things. Our brains all work differently. Some of us are more academic. Some of us are more creative. Some of us are more heart driven. Some of us are more results driven or approval driven. We're all different. I would just love to see, and I know this is utopia, but to just have total acceptance for each other. And I think teaching other children tolerance of kids who are different because what is normal anyway? We are all different and individual. But I guess, you know, somebody who really stands out is being different. Bullying is the big issue. And I think us as adults, to set the example to our kids and to model being kind to everybody, to looking for everybody's strengths and their greatness, rather than focusing on. On the things that make them different, that might be teasable, you know what I mean? So I would love to see under that umbrella just a world where we can all help and support each other for our strengths, for our differences. But I think it has to start with us parents mentoring and modeling for our children to be fine, upstanding citizens who treat people respectfully. That is the kid in the playground who might be getting teased by somebody else. Are you going to stand up for that kid or are you going to stand in the background and go, well, I don't want to be bullied or teaching the kids who are the potential bullies. That's not how a human being treats another person. I do get the labels. I've had this discussion with many people. I don't call somebody or they're an adhder or they're autistic, they have been diagnosed, they have certain qualities that present themselves. That's not who they are as a person. So I would love people to be just seen as who they are. And those who need help get their help. So if you need help academically, if you need help with your social skills, if you need help with whatever, just to be able to assist and help people for whatever they need, regardless of whatever their title or their diagnosis is. But unfortunately, I know that's never going to happen because we need diagnosis to be able to give them that support. But yeah, I'm not a fan. I think kids take that on as something wrong with them, that I am disabled. I do have a disability where I don't see them as a disability. I see them as just having a different way of coping with things, using their brain, processing things. Some people who have been diagnosed with various things, they are brilliant people, absolutely brilliant. But they might be a bit quirky, they might not be great with their social skills. So let's help them with the things they need help with and embrace the greatness that they have with the things that show that. And let's just help each other to feel good about each other, especially kids. Because kids can be damn mean. Like they really can be mean to each other.
[00:40:08] Speaker A: Yes, yes.
[00:40:09] Speaker B: But that comes from home. Not always, but I really believe if parents parent their kids to have compassion and to be kind, then they're less likely to be a bully. Usually the bully is a kid or a person who does not feel good about themselves. Therefore they bully or tease somebody else to feel that, that validation for themselves. A vicious cycle that we need to somehow kind of get in and stop.
[00:40:35] Speaker A: So getting in and stopping. Is there anything with what you guys do that may be the kid, the parent or the teacher, some teachings for them or some tips for them? That may be a terminology, a way to react, a way to interact?
[00:40:49] Speaker B: I think just teaching kids because it starts with kids, doesn't it? To be compassionate, to see the good in people, even if they're different and even if they're not your kind of person, that you might not want to hang out with, but to still be kind and compassionate to them or stick up for them. If another kid's not being kind to them, that's the kid I would be proud of if they were my kid. That kid who might get teased by nine out of ten people and you're that 10th kid who says something nice or sticks up for them or is compassionate or understands you are going to make a huge difference to that kid's life. But it starts with us adults, because we can model bad behaviour. I've seen some very bad behavior from people who should know better and saying things to their kids and in front of their kids. So adults, it starts with us. And if we show compassion to others, that's how we teach our kids, to be compassionate, to be kind. When we're compassionate and kind, we model it and they see us and they see that's how we behave and they're going to mirror that.
[00:41:46] Speaker A: It's a big topic. It's a really big topic.
[00:41:47] Speaker B: A huge topic. Yeah.
[00:41:49] Speaker A: Especially in this, this industry. There's kids, they don't go back to school because of they so many things. Because.
[00:41:56] Speaker B: Absolutely. Kids, kids are refusing to go to school because, and they don't always want to tell their parents because they're being bullied, because they feel ashamed, they feel inadequate and maybe they don't feel comfortable sharing it, which is why also open relationships, you know, having open communication with your kids is good so that they feel that they can come and tell you. And then also parents, it's how we, how do we respond to that? How do we help that kid? It's not about, oh, I'm going to beat that kid up. That's not the solution.
[00:42:25] Speaker A: You feel like it, though.
[00:42:26] Speaker B: Yeah. And often if you're a good parent of a kid who's been mean to another kid, you feel bad about that. And obviously, you know, hopefully you would give a lesson, you know, a compassionate lesson to your bully kid to have them understand how impacting that is. I don't know if you've heard of the chicken soup books. Chicken soup for the soul.
[00:42:46] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:42:47] Speaker B: So when I was teaching, I remember in one class there was a girl who was from a different religion and she had to dress in a certain way according to her religion, which was not trendy, according to the other 1112 year old girls who can be very judgmental. They were mean to this girl and she kept having so many days of school and I was reading between the lines, it's because they were being mean.
[00:43:09] Speaker A: To her instead of her education, because.
[00:43:12] Speaker B: Instead of giving a lecture to them, I actually went through my chicken soup for the soul books and found some stories that had them thinking about the impact of bullying. And then that led to some discussions because they were good kids, they weren't bad kids. There was a particular little clique of girls who. Who were teasing. Before she came back, we discussed some strategies about how to make her feel better. And when those girls changed their attitude towards that girl, that girl just lived up. But you know what? It did as much for the girl who was being teased as it did for the girls who were the teasers, because they actually felt better themselves, because I don't think they were feeling good about the way they were treating her, but it's almost like they were in this little clique. So if they wanted to be in the clique, she's teasing, so I need to tease. So it's kind of like a group mentality. We had some classroom discussions. It led to a lot of really good conversations. Sometimes kids don't realize the impact of communicating that way to other kids. Then they're not necessarily a real bully at heart.
[00:44:16] Speaker A: Kids aren't. Their brains aren't involved enough to understand the full concept of their actions. It doesn't make their actions right, and their actions do have repercussions and sometimes lifetime for some of these kids.
[00:44:27] Speaker B: But unfortunately, there are a lot of adult bullies, and that's modeled. If you're a parent who's a bully to a child or even to another, what example is that to your children? Even be, you know, road rage and stuff like that? A passing mean comment. Oh, look at that lady. Look how fat she is. What example is that to your children?
[00:44:46] Speaker A: Definitely something I'm delving into. One of the things I noticed while I was doing the editing is your use of a word you often say rather than relationship. Relationship ing. So I'm thinking that is, relationship is something that is.
[00:45:01] Speaker B: It's my made up word.
[00:45:02] Speaker A: Or relationship ing is something that you do.
[00:45:06] Speaker B: Yeah, I've made it into a verb.
[00:45:07] Speaker A: When you're editing, you go over the same thing a few times, and I'm like, yeah, I don't think, does that word exist?
[00:45:14] Speaker B: I don't think it does. I think I made it up because somebody else said relationshiping. It's even in my blurb. It's even in my bio, because it's a verb. It's a doing word. We're relationshiping.
[00:45:26] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:45:26] Speaker B: I don't know if it's a real word, but if it's not, I've made it up.
[00:45:30] Speaker A: Two people are talking about it now. It exists. There you go. Webster's. Come on. Looking back on your journey, what are you the most pressure.
[00:45:37] Speaker B: My husband and I stepped up into the parents that we really needed to be. That we made the effort, got the help, identified, that we needed the help, and that it wasn't just about our son, but that it was about us and that we needed to change us.
[00:45:50] Speaker A: Cool. And I'm holding myself back from deep diving into that answer. Great answer. What message would you like to leave our listeners with today?
[00:45:58] Speaker B: If you are a parent, an educator, a caregiver of any sort, remember how powerful your words are. Words can be used to build somebody up or to bring them down. So before you open your mouth, if you remember the analogy from our last call with the watering can, what are you going to water what you want to grow, or water something you don't want to grow? Think before you speak. Your words are powerful. And let's get our language right side up instead of upside down, which it is for a lot of us currently.
[00:46:27] Speaker A: Yes. Lillian, thank you so much for sharing your story and your insights with us. I will put some links to get your free book and that's downloadable, so I will share that. That will be available on. That should be available on both the podcast and the YouTube. Thank you again. Thank you to our listeners for tuning into this episode of vicarious insights, and remember to subscribe for more insightful discussions. Stay healthy, stay motivated, and keep learning until next time.
[00:46:53] Speaker B: Thank you, Jace. Thank you.
